two horses of four out due to lameness and sore feet after we had the farrier out last Thursday.
We've had the same farrier for quite a few months now and we like his work and his attitude towards our horses, I think he has developed very serious feelings towards Rosanna, and she is the one that got trimmed a little bit to short this time and she is not happy. Now I dare not call my farrier and tell him that Rosanna is sore and might need shoes, would he forgive himself doing this to his girl?
We have not had to shoe any of our horses yet as they have been doing fine on the perfect Florida sand so far. We will see when we increase the work load when they become four year olds.
Well instead of riding there is always the never ending project "protect the horses from injuring themselves" to work on, building fences, checking fences, stalls and pastures, repairing fences and stalls.
Fall cleaning of the stalls will be done by the kids, they are older now and I therefore have to pay them per hour, they are also well informed and know the minimum wages for the state of Florida.

I tried to find a picture with fall feelings, here is one of Merdjen as a yearling in Sweden.

1. Gun Eile11/20/2006 10:43:15

Wonderful picture!
Congratulations to the photographer.

2. Tabitha11/21/2006 04:22:02

Hi Jessica,

Just give it time, in a few days/a week her sole will have adjusted and she'll be walking wonderfull again.

If that's not the case then call the farrier. But horse's hoofs are a little miracle of mother nature. They adjust themselves, right now her hoof mechanisme is probably working hard to speed growing back that what was cut of too much. If you can leave them without shoes then do, there's nothing better as mother nature.

Best wishes

Tabitha

3. maria11/21/2006 04:31:12

Tabitha, is Agan going barefoot? Are you doing any roadwork?

4. Jessica 11/21/2006 08:04:38

Thanks for the encouraging words Tabitha.
One of our lamenesses seems to be gone this morning and she will be walked under rider today.
Rosanna will need more time to grow her feet back to her comfort zone again. This reminds me of the horrible mud freezes we used to have in Sweden this time of the year. The barefoot horses really suffered when they had to walk on the frozen mud.

5. Tabitha11/22/2006 06:09:56

Maria,

Agan is indeed barefoot and I intend to keep him that way.
And yes, he does road work. He needs it, because other wise his hoofs grow to long. Our soil here is actually too soft for the hooves to wear off naturally so that's why he needs trimming. Best would be if we had some rocky areas just like the wild horses in the USA, Australia and in Spain (though the latter are partially domesticated) to compensate the soft soil but that's not the case unfortunately.

But the best thing of bare hooves is that when it snows (which happened the past three years in a row in February) he still can go outside, while the horses with irons are trapped in their stables. Andhe has better grip/hold when the groud/grass is all wet and muddy as horses with irons.

Jessica, We have no experience with frozen mud over here so I wouldn't know how that would feel to a horse's foot. Can imagine that when it's sharp it'll hurt the frog (is that the right word?).

Perhaps interesting links for both of you:
[url]www.hoofrehab.com[/url]
[url]www.equethy.com[/url

6. Maria11/22/2006 17:18:44

Tabitha, I have kept Mualim barefoot too, so far, mostly for safety. I am not sure about gripping barefoot on wet grass though - Mualim slides around wet steep ground as if he has skates on him. You don't have this problem with steep ground in Holland!

I don't think our ground is that hard but Mualim has hardly anything worth trimming - it all wears down. So the farrier only uses a rasp.

It would be interesting to see how it progresses. A neighbour of mine is attending a barefoot trimming course at the moment and wants to take shoes off her endurance horses. I will be watching with interest. It's cheaper, that's for sure!

7. Darya11/23/2006 03:54:37
Homepage: http://www.avatstud.com

Maria,
I've heard of this foot trimming courses when I went to BHS course. They sent one of theirs to try it out and didn't think it was that good and safe for the horse. Farriers study their job for years, I'm not sure I would want someone going on a quick course and than having the freedom with a knife around the horse. Mine are barefoot so far as well, because they do not have any problems, so I do not see the point. They are not going on hard surfaces a lot now anyways. I think it is better for the pasture, and safety too. He does like to go galloping across the field and than suddenly put his breaks on and slide a good distance half-sitting down. It must be part of the fun of being out.

8. Tabitha11/23/2006 05:16:41

Hi Darya

Here in the Netherlands farriers study for years too. But the majority off that time they learn to work with iron and make garden gates and other stuff of iron. They do learn how to make all kinds of iron shoes and what they're used for, but they hardly learn anything about how a hoof works by nature. They learn everything about ironed hooves. They learn how to cut them and how to put shoes on, but the farrier that pays attention to how the horse walks and can tell you why the way he treats the hoof is the best way for your horse's health are rare. Even their study books only show hooves with iron. No bare hooves in sight there to teach them how that kind of hoof works/needs.

There are so much horses going to slaughter houses because of foot problems that could've been cured just by trimming them well but the farrier just put on another kind of iron to solve the problem and instead make the problems go worse.

I did a trimming course myself and practiced on hooves of slaughtered horses that must have been so in pain before their death. Even the ones that clearly were treated regularly by a farrier.
But I agree with you that even though you get a thorough theorie exam and a huge book to learn and half a day practicing on dead horse's hooves it isn't enough. Though you do learn really much about the horse's hooves and the effect hooves can have on your horse's health and you do learn what to avoid and what signs are bad but it is so very different from rasping (that's all you need to do if the hoof is ok) your own LIVING horse's hooves. That's why I'm going to another course that's offering 3 days of practicing, first day on dead hooves, second and 3rd day on living horses and if you want on your own horse.
i'm lucky to have a farrier that does know a lot about horse's hooves and whose trimming comes really close to natural trimming so untill I feel confident I'm not going to do it myself .

But I can advice every horse owner to follow a course like that. If only to learn how something important to a horse as his hooves work so you can distinguish a good farrier from a bad one and can quickly recognise if your horse is developping hoof problems and needs urgent trimming/food adjustments.

9. Darya11/23/2006 05:47:09
Homepage: http://www.avatstud.com

Hi Tabitha,
I agree learning about the hoof is important, and it is a big part of the 3 part course I am doing called Horse Owners Course run by BHS (British Horse Society). No foot no horse, they say. From what they told me on that course the farriers learn a lot about the structure of the hoof and how it works, and more so they learn about the balance of the horse. They told us a good farrier will always want to see the horse walk on the flat hard surface and will always make sure that they trimmed the horse properly and have not interferred with the balance of the horse. But you are right, there are some bad old farriers with die hard habits... I'm talking for UK of course, may be it is different in other countries... Here they are crazy about animals, their wealth and rights.

10. Tabitha11/23/2006 08:41:58

Oh.. here too!! They are now changing the study books of farriers so the new load of farrieres should be really good .

Learning about hooves really changes the way you look at a horse. Now I first check the hooves and then look up at how the horse looks . Even though I am just there to enjoy the horse and not to judge it. I can't help myself.

11. Maria11/23/2006 09:09:48

Tabitha

You probably know there are different schools of barefoot trimming. Which one are you following? One of the systems in England which has a controversial name is Dr Strasse's. The Laminitis Trust here is dead opposed to it. But then there are other systems as well. The course my friend is following (which is a long one - several months) is not Dr Strasse's, I am not sure what its "official name" is... What I heard people say that Dr Strasse's system takes out a lot of sole and those uneven bits along the frog - can't remember what you call them. There is a Teke owner in the UK who trims all her horses according to DrStrasse's system, one has been show-jumping for many years and the others are ridden daily for 2-3 hours, all barefoot.

Regarding farriers in England, Darya - they are a closed shop and are generally a disaster. They belong to a guild which only trains so many of them a year, so there is almost no competition and they tend to be unreliable, refuse business and certainly more than half of them are a liability as far as horses' feet are concerned. It's a very very depressing situation but BHS will never admit it because it's all stitched, they depend on each other if you see what I mean... It's very tempting to learn to trim your own horses' feet if only because you don't have to live in fear of these guys not turning up.

12. Maria11/23/2006 09:13:12

Tabitha, what's your view on bitless bridles and treeless saddles? No, seriously, now that we are on the subject of alternatives...

What's Agan wearing? I am going through hell and high water trying to find a saddle for Mualim who has a dead-straight back and massive shoulder swing. And for a bit, I use "happy mouth" which is a plastic supposedly kinder bit but the bitless bridle on that Australian link you gave looks very smart! (Of course, not allowed under BHS and FEI but they won't know if we use it in the privacy of our own home, right?)

13. Darya11/23/2006 10:08:28
Homepage: http://www.avatstud.com

Maria,
I only go about what they told me on the course, which I mentioned. May be they are not telling us something- I guess I will soon find out. Could you keep me posted on your friend's progress with that course please? I would like to know more, may be it is worth considering it. That bridle sounds interesting. Looks like it is possible to order it in UK. I am thinking of giving it a go, as my Dom doesn't like the bit that much. It is tempting as it can improve our relationship, if I posses less unpleasant things for him.

14. Maria11/23/2006 10:17:49

Darya, I will introduce you to Jane when you come down to visit us. I will also show you my bit collection - there is a soft straight rubber one which they all love and if you are brave enough to ride in it, it really work well It's almost as "bit-less" as a bitless bridle

15. Darya11/23/2006 12:07:00
Homepage: http://www.avatstud.com

Thanks, Maria, I am looking forward to that.

16. Tabitha11/28/2006 04:10:11

Hi Maria,

The course I followed and the one I'm going to follow are based on Pete Ramey (www.hoofrehab.com).
Strasser is controversial here too. Most natural farriers I have met/spoken do agree she gets results but they get them too by taking more time to adjust the hoof to its natural form.
Strasser immediately cuts the hoof to the perfect form and that results in a long long recovery time for the horse (sometimes up to 1,5 years before you can ride again, but then you can do everything with your horse again the feet will hold).
Peter Ramey and his followers do it more gradually so the horse and its hoof can adjust to the new stand before going further. This way in 1,5 year they get the same result as Strasser but you can keep riding your horse almost the whole time (only when horses have been on irons for a long time and then suddenly go barefoot, it can take a few weeks/2 months before their sole has grown thick enough to stop being sensitive but then you can start riding again, but that's a lot of months less recovery time then with Strasser).

I ride Agan bitless. he did learn riding with bit but he listens so much better without it that I just quit using it. I ride him on a rope halter but I do agree dr Cook's bitless bridle looks tempting. Here in the Netherlands there are a lot of people uniting to organise a bitless dressage competition. So who knows in future it will be allowed.

About treeless saddles, I'm testing one right now, I love it. Agan not so much since that thing at his withers is pressing on his withers. I tried on another and Agan loved that one. He behaved like he was thinking: "so, now this finally is a nice saddle. Now we can go for a good ride". Somehting he didn't do with his fitting tree saddle. It's a Startek saddle and there's lots of room for high withers. So I think I'm going for that one but it's an expensive saddle so I'll have to save.
And it's too bad because with this saddle I only can go for endurance. it's not allowed at dressage/jumping/eventing competitions so I'll need to switch back to the tree saddle for those things.
The saddle I'm testing now is allowed at dressage competitions (the lower levels).

17. maria11/29/2006 11:39:52

Tabitha, that's very interesting. I found out that the system my friend here is using is a UK branch of Jamie Jackson's system (http://www.uknhcp.org/) and I think it's the same one as your Peter Ramey, I am not exactly sure of the connection between the two men. They also advocate cereal-free diet. I looked at Mualim's bare feet the other day - they have improved a lot since he first came here, I guess they must have been trimmed too short before. I also tried a treeless saddle - Bob Marshall one - but I only sat in it, didn't ride very far. It's brilliant for the freedom of the shoulder and you can get what they call "high-peak" version, for horses with higher withers. But you couldn't do anything classical in it! If I had unlimited means, I would buy it for riding out and then have a conventional saddle for schooling. As it is, my saddle fitter is coming back tomorrow (3rd session!) with more conventional saddles to see if we can find anything suitable. I heard about the attempts to persuade the establishment to use bitless bridles. Mualim likes his bit, so I am not too worried about the "head end" Maybe I can come and see Agan when I am next in Holland...